I have a few co workers that follow a faith that believe GOD literally hated Esau. I would like to know if the following examples are correct in proving Romans 9:13 didn't mean hate, but that GOD loved Jacob more or does it mean GOD choose Jacob over Esau?

I'm using the KJV because that is what they use.

from the OT Gen. 29:31 "And when the Lord saw that Leah was HATED, he opened her womb: but Rachel was barren." Then i would show him Gen. 29:30 " And he went in also unto Rachel, and he LOVED also Rachel MORE THAN Leah, and served with him yet seven other years."

and from the NT Luke 14:26 "If any man come to me, and HATE not his father, and mother, and wife, and children, and brethren, and sisters, yea, and his own life also, he cannot be my disciple." then show him Matthew 10:37 " He that LOVETH father or mother MORE THAN me is not worthy of me: and he that LOVETH son or daughter MORE THAN me is not worthy of me."

Are both of these correct examples to use to show Hated and loved more can be used in scripture sometimes to mean the same thing? Also is luke and Matthew describing the same event or two different events when Jesus was teaching?

One last example since they except the apocrypha from the 1611 KJV. Wisdom 11:24-26 "24 For thou louest all the things that are, and abhorrest nothing which thou hast made: for neuer wouldest thou haue made any thing, if thou hadst hated it. 25 And how could any thing haue endured if it had not beene thy will? or beene preserued, if not called by thee? 26 But thou sparest all: for they are thine, O Lord, thou louer of soules

Would it be correct that these verses prove since GOD Made (created) Esau He could not have hated him? and because in vs 26 it speaks of the Lord as "thou louer of soules" means the context of 24-26 is speaking of created man as well as everything else GOD Made?

Thanks Father Echert

Robert

The an cient Hebrew language did not have the comparative and superlative forms that we have in English and so it expressed these by other means, such as repetition of words: Holy, Holy, Holy means Most Holy, for instance. So, too, comparison can be used by opposites: love and hate. In addition, the Hebrew language employed hyperboles to make a point that we would deem inappropriate, such as "hate your father or mother", meaning in reality, prefer God above all. So we can apply these principles to the situation of Jacob being preferred over Esau. In addition, it could be the case that Jacob possessed sanctifying grace, such that he was alive at the supernatural level, but Esau was lacking in this grace, meaning he was only loveable at the natural level, not the supernatural.

Thanks, Robert

Father Echert

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